"High-End" BBQ`

quote:

Originally posted by SmokinOkie:
So, someone asked me the question the other day, one of those "over a couple of beers" type discussion.

If you were doing very upscale catering BBQ, what would you do? I've got some ideas I'll share later, but wanted to throw it out as a topic.

Great topic, but can you give an example of high end? Is it just food (type like lobster,premium meats??, surroundings set up ??

Premium Meats for sure; Waygu, Duroc Pork, Squab/Cornish Game Hen, etc.

Exotic/Unique ingredients (you know you Chefs out there know what I mean)

More unique/prep requirements than just the simple smoke and serve. More labor intensive (prep, cook or finish/serve)

Maybe some food that isn't the "traditional" basic BBQ; Brisket, ribs, chicken, PB.

Well. If you're looking for ideas, I'll step out on a limb and offer a couple I've done.

I posted this awhile back and it offers a different BBQ flare. Tastes great:

Smoked Gyros Roast

I'm sure you can create a version of this using your imagination. A nice Tzatziki Sauce or some other gravy type sauce drizzled over the sliced roast would add a "chef's touch" to the dish. This dish still says BBQ, but offers a different slant.

Another item that's given me great success is this recipe:

Smoke Porterhouse Steak

Smoke a steak and then finish it on the grill. I'm sure one of your smoker grills would work nicely. Porterhouse or Kansas City Style Rib Eye would handle this style very well.

What would a high end BBQ place be like without:

Smoked Salmon

I just posted this salmon recipe for an idea. There are others on here that would work just as well or better.

Last but not least:

Smokin Okie's Smoked Prime Rib

You know the recipe.

Hope this helps some or gives others some ideas for you.

Pork: Duroc, Tamworth, Berkshire (kurabuta)

Fowl: Moulard Duck (breasts brine and smoke well) Poussin (baby chicken), Goose breast (brined, seared & cold smoked. Emu.

Game: boar, antelope, moose, elk.

Seafood: scallops, lobster tail, monkfish tail/cheeks, Halibut, smoked salmon or trout.

Playing around with molecular gastronomy would be fun but this horse left the barn long before that took off. Pricey equipment and supplies to boot.

That's all I got given a half cup of breakfast coffee...will chime in with more ideas when/if they gel.

Of course the REAL hurdle is finding a target audience willing to pony up $100 @ plate + for this type of errrrrr....dare I say? Smoked Cuisine.

I instantly think of seafood. Smoked oysters, sea bass, lobster, shrimp, scallops, all on a kabob with a nicely seared grilled NY Steak.

I think folks hit it on the head with their food suggestions - now I'm hungry, from rib eye to monk fish and lobster. I think if going high-end, it would be equally important to boost the presentation, black coats and bowties on the staff, nice chafing dishes, and finishing on a fast-eddy charbroiler if mobil. The charbroiler opens up some nice options, as you could lightly smoke lobster and other fish, and finish on charbroiler, same with meats and fish. Folks could order cooked how they like.I liked some of the Game meats people suggested, but depends on the crowd ? Some people can eat a cornish hen, but much past that and it's entering their 'bambi' zone.

If your going with petifores, along with side dishes, you could have all sorts of fun. Do some 'lobster rolls' cut up small, using smoked lobster. Something we have done is making a fattie, and slicing down thin served on a small piece of garlic toast ... that's tasty stuff. Smoked sausage stuffed mushrooms. Smoked variety of sausages sliced and tooth picked on top of a slice of cornbread. Smoked cheeses, smoked chesses toothpicked to a smoked meat.

If you go this way, I'll be courious whether the final costs hit the bang for the buck for the client.

For a dessert, something my wife did recently was a take-off based on banana pudding and nilla wafers. She kicked it up a notch by making s amall vanilla cupcake, then making a whipped topping of banana pudding and melted white chocolate. She then drizzles with both a raspberry topping and dark chocolate topping. It's a little more work than some desserts, but could possibly work for the high-end theme.

Courious to hear how this proceeds . . .
Rick

quote:

Originally posted by SmokinOkie:
So, someone asked me the question the other day, one of those "over a couple of beers" type discussion.

If you were doing very upscale catering BBQ, what would you do? I've got some ideas I'll share later, but wanted to throw it out as a topic.

I'm sorry, but high end and BBQ just don't sound right,just being honest.

I don't disagree Cal, but every once in awhile, I've got to kick it up a notch.

I get what you're saying cal but look at what some chefs do with hamburgers. And now donuts and croissants have struck a marriage.

It's where a little creativity meets barbecue. It's OK.

OK, here are my thoughts. For something to be high end, it needs to be special. Special can be how it's prepared, served or what it is, but it has to be something out of the ordinary. Waygu beef is special by it's nature, Lobster is special Monk Fish in Alabama not so much.

I think (my self included) people will pay extra for special things or special occasions. Having said that remember what that great Ameican Bon Qui Qui said "Don't go crazy"

If you try to make something special that is really not just so you can charge more, that will only work for a short time.

So what's high end? Excellent and I mean excellent service, excellent surroundings (when eating out this includes the restroom) great taste, and above average portions (they can take leftovers home)

So in my opinion the experience is just as important in making something special as is the product. I think what one would consider normal BBQ food that is prepared in an excellent manner, in and excellent surrounding to be considered high end. It's all about quality in my opinion. A bad lobster is still a bad lobster and the same goes for what ever the He#* Monk Fish is. Attention to detail makes things special and will always keep me coming back.

Monkfish is found in New England waters. The fish itself is one ugly S.O.B. Both the tail and cheek meat are utilized. Either has a somewhat firm texture but is somewhat bland in flavor on it's own. It can be grilled, broiled, baked or sautéed. Any preparation that works well for sea scallops will work well for Monkfish.

side note: 20 years ago this once under utilized species was dirt cheap. Now it commands a price in $10 @ lb +/- range.

Well, for "high end" BBQ, you'll have to move to NY City. Down South, it's a commodity and people don't want to pay more than about $10 a head, give or take, but up North BBQ is "special" and can command a higher price. But my jaded outlook aside, here's kind of the hierarchy I use:

Basic: Pork BBQ and chicken w/3 sides

Level 1: add ribs and/or brisket
Level 2: add oysters, either 1/2 shell, rockfeller, or steamed
Level 3: add cook wears shoes and a shirt
Level 4: add grilled whole fish of some type, bar service
Level 5: add real plates and forks instead of plastic
Level 6: add apps and other displays: salads, fruit, desserts
Level 7: add "Showy display" using fancy chaffers and/or food show like fancy chopping block and "show chopping"
Level 8: add servers, pretty servers cost extra
Level 9: add seated table service
Level 10: add I don't know what level 10 would be, maybe live music or dancing girls.

Todd. At level 3, you'd force Smokin to wear a shirt and shoes.

Hi Russ, I am very sure that you and I need to have lunch sometime. I would love to team up with you on this subject.

Sounds like maybe ambiance-fitting- could be a major part.
Some of us that have passed thru some Island paradises might have felt that #3 above could have spoiled the presentation of the cook-depending?

I guess after we define bbq it could be appropriate offerings ,prepared well.Is this what "we" think of as a Southern/Western American culinary art?
Those cast off offerings prepared at a level that fine chefs of other cultures might be amazed.

Chris Lilly,with our own drbbq assisting,was the Chef at the James Beard House Dinner,with what we might not have thought bbq from north Alabama.

Tuffy/Cool Smoke [before he became KCBS TOY] brought to China to cater, about what we are discussing.[Richmond,VA bbq cook]

The Mansion at Turtle Creek,a southern American hillbilly cook from over the next hollow from me in the hills of KY,that might be considered in the finest in Texas.


Sorry,it is not haute' cuisine...but?

quote:

Originally posted by MaxQ:
I get what you're saying cal but look at what some chefs do with hamburgers. And now donuts and croissants have struck a marriage.

Yeah and I refuse to wait in that ridiculous line at 6am for a donut, lol. I'll wait 45 minutes in front of Totonno's for a pizza, but a donut? C'mon.

Sorry, went off topic.

quote:

Originally posted by Cook One:
OK, here are my thoughts. For something to be high end, it needs to be special. Special can be how it's prepared, served or what it is, but it has to be something out of the ordinary. Waygu beef is special by it's nature, Lobster is special Monk Fish in Alabama not so much.

I think (my self included) people will pay extra for special things or special occasions. Having said that remember what that great Ameican Bon Qui Qui said "Don't go crazy"

If you try to make something special that is really not just so you can charge more, that will only work for a short time.

So what's high end? Excellent and I mean excellent service, excellent surroundings (when eating out this includes the restroom) great taste, and above average portions (they can take leftovers home)

So in my opinion the experience is just as important in making something special as is the product. I think what one would consider normal BBQ food that is prepared in an excellent manner, in and excellent surrounding to be considered high end. It's all about quality in my opinion. A bad lobster is still a bad lobster and the same goes for what ever the He#* Monk Fish is. Attention to detail makes things special and will always keep me coming back.

If I were going to do high end bbq I do agree with you about special and excellent ingredients and preparation. I don't thing the surroundings have to be high end though, I wouldn't want to serve or eat bbq in a fine dining white table atmosphere. I think you can look at some of the ingredients and preparations used in competitive bbq and use that in offering a high end bbq offering in a restaurant setting. For the last year I have been trying to formulate some ideas for a restaurant of my own, and one idea is to take the idea of the chef's table or tasting menu that some high end restaurants do and give it a bbq twist by making the menu a competition BBQ tasting. For maybe $100 bucks a head you go through the 4 main meats prepared just as an award winning bbq team would do, with perfectly trimmed picture perfect food, along with some quality sides served family style on the table. Each meat comes out one after the other, with a small portion of each, one cupcake thigh, 2 slices of brisket and 2 burnt end chunks, 2-3 bones, a pork served three ways with a slice of mm, a little mound of pulled, and a few chunks of bark. As each course is brought out the well trained server explains the preparation and amount of time it took to make each perfectly sculpted product. With this concept, you are staying true to bbq, but kicking it up a notch and making it something special and high end.

Here in Dallas a restaurant has gone in called 'Smoke' It is a rather nice dining experience with a different twist.

http://www.smokerestaurant.com

Whoa - I don't think my customers would appreciate if I jacked my pulled pork sandwich price to $17 !

quote:

Originally posted by Coach:
Here in Dallas a restaurant has gone in called 'Smoke' It is a rather nice dining experience with a different twist.

http://www.smokerestaurant.com

I recently went to a "critically acclaimed" Gourmet BBQ joint in New Orleans. The only good thing was that the overpriced portions were small. That way we didn't have to eat that much!

Spend a ton of money on marketing.

Once again, I will say "High End" in my opinion does not have to be weird or different, it simply has to be the best.

With all this discussion of 'high end', I thought I'd share something regarding 'low end', which could be 'high end' in it's own sort of way. I've been pondering doing a promotion, likely towards fall, of original 'pit' bbq. I mean the real pit, a trench dug in the dirt with the wood burning down in it, then the meats and chicken on sticks laying across the pit. I think this might serve well for promotion.

quote:

Originally posted by astronorick:
With all this discussion of 'high end', I thought I'd share something regarding 'low end', which could be 'high end' in it's own sort of way. I've been pondering doing a promotion, likely towards fall, of original 'pit' bbq. I mean the real pit, a trench dug in the dirt with the wood burning down in it, then the meats and chicken on sticks laying across the pit. I think this might serve well for promotion.

Dig a pit and do a whole hog. That should get some attention.

quote:

Originally posted by Coach:
Here in Dallas a restaurant has gone in called 'Smoke' It is a rather nice dining experience with a different twist.

http://www.smokerestaurant.com

I've eaten at Smoke twice, but only at the bar. I've had the brisket sandwich and cabrito, and both were excellent. As a side, the bacon and cheddar cheese grits were outstanding. Nice place, good service, great food, and a good vibe. All in all it's a very nice place, and I would definitely go back when in the area.

quote:

Originally posted by dls:

quote:

Originally posted by astronorick:
With all this discussion of 'high end', I thought I'd share something regarding 'low end', which could be 'high end' in it's own sort of way. I've been pondering doing a promotion, likely towards fall, of original 'pit' bbq. I mean the real pit, a trench dug in the dirt with the wood burning down in it, then the meats and chicken on sticks laying across the pit. I think this might serve well for promotion.

Dig a pit and do a whole hog. That should get some attention.

It's funny how location matters. If you dug a pit and did a whole hog here, nobody would notice. That's so 1870.

Thanks for ALL the inputs Even the silly ones (and you know who you are).

So, just so you know, I'm smoking for a charity function and it's not for commercial sale but it's a group of 150 very high end people. Heck, I agree, high end BBQ isn't BBQ.

But that doesn't mean that has to stay that way.

For me, High End is BBQ that people don't get every day. Waygu Brisket, Berkshire Pork, various poultry (game hens, quail, etc).

I'm experimenting now, so you'll just have to wait to see what I come up with But I'll take you along for the ride.

Still researching...

I went to the Smoke Restaurant site and the menu sure looked good.

But I wonder (and this is not a knock on them at all) how much of their success is hype, and how much is based on food quality?

I just did some consulting for a restaurant that was all hype and no substance. Their food is a solid 5 on a 10pt scale, but their prices were a 12. But they constantly hyped so that they got enough one time customers to keep the place full.

It's discouraging, but I know quite a few restaurants in this area that survive, maybe even thrive, on this strategy. You can find many of them mentioned over and over on various Food Network shows. Ever notice how DDD, Rachel Ray, Bobby Flay, US Of Bacon, Burger Land, etc always seem to go to the same places?

It's always sad to me that shows visit places like The BBQ Pit in Raleigh, when Holdens and Clyde Coopers are only a few miles away, but are a whole world better, as long as you bring cash and don't expect wine with your swine.
Holden's BBQ
Clyde Coopers

quote:

Originally posted by Todd G.:
I went to the Smoke Restaurant site and the menu sure looked good.

But I wonder (and this is not a knock on them at all) how much of their success is hype, and how much is based on food quality?

I just did some consulting for a restaurant that was all hype and no substance. Their food is a solid 5 on a 10pt scale, but their prices were a 12. But they constantly hyped so that they got enough one time customers to keep the place full.

It's discouraging, but I know quite a few restaurants in this area that survive, maybe even thrive, on this strategy. You can find many of them mentioned over and over on various Food Network shows. Ever notice how DDD, Rachel Ray, Bobby Flay, US Of Bacon, Burger Land, etc always seem to go to the same places?

It's always sad to me that shows visit places like The BBQ Pit in Raleigh, when Holdens and Clyde Coopers are only a few miles away, but are a whole world better, as long as you bring cash and don't expect wine with your swine.
Holden's BBQ
Clyde Coopers

I agree I have eaten there once and will not go back, regardless of the price (expense report) it was just not that good. They try to make something "special" by doing everything but improving the taste. Any place that ask if you want tap water (like if you take it you will be the only faceless troll in the place) or bottled water for the table, while serving average or below food, is not high end. I'm not saying... I'm just saying. In the south we can say this as long as we end with bless their heart...

I've looked emu before, and it's alot like roast beef. For a fun BBQ comp in my hometown, I researched getting a full size emu to put on a big Heiniken(sp) keg can for "shock factor", but them dang emu folks want like $500 for one because they sell the rendered oil and not necessarily the meat. When we did the emu, the market totally fell out on them and people were just turning them lose. I think we paid like $15 for a dressed emu at the time. I've tried to do a buffalo hump roast as well just for something creative, but they are hard to find as well cause most just get ground for burger. Could maybe do something like alligator tail?

quote:

Originally posted by SmokinOkie:
Thanks for ALL the inputs Even the silly ones (and you know who you are).

So, just so you know, I'm smoking for a charity function and it's not for commercial sale but it's a group of 150 very high end people. Heck, I agree, high end BBQ isn't BBQ.

But that doesn't mean that has to stay that way.

For me, High End is BBQ that people don't get every day. Waygu Brisket, Berkshire Pork, various poultry (game hens, quail, etc).

I'm experimenting now, so you'll just have to wait to see what I come up with But I'll take you along for the ride.

Still researching...

Now your giving us more info to go on....

Burnt ends made of prime beef

Game hens brined, I think you can do that

Competition quality ribs

Guaranteed to be something they haven't ate and would consider high end! I'd even consider it BBQ.

Now some Okies might consider a whole longhorn on a spit and pit,if it was for the rich guys in Austin.

I have a smokin' week feature coming up in my restaurant here soon. I wanted to offer more than just a freaking combo platter. We already offer ribs, pulled pork and smoke our own pastrami and prime rib.

Here are the featured items I came up with.

Cheese and Duck Salumi
Cured and smoked duck breast salumi, smoked cheeses, and olives to start your meal.

Cowboy Porchetta
Classic Italian pork dish meets the smoker.
An entire side from the loin to the belly rolled up with fennel, garlic and herbs and slow smoked. Served with garlic polenta and cherry mostarda.

Smoked Duck Ramen
Tea smoked duck legs with house made ramen noodles in a rich broth studded with baby bok choy, shiitake mushrooms and scallions.

Texas Brisket
Slow smoked over twelve hours sliced and served with grilled sweet potatoes, collard greens and smoked jalapeno corn bread.

Smoked Lobster Pasta
We smoke the lobster and the tomatoes then toss them with house made fettuccine, fresh asparagus, garlic, basil, olive oil with a white wine butter sauce.

quote:

Originally posted by kaffeenjunkie:
I have a smokin' week feature ...

Awesome looking "high end" stuff. Let us know how the customers react to it.

Hey Russ,

What did you ever come up with for your charity cook last year? Just curious.

There's an "upscale" BBQ restaurant in the Chicago Gold Coast neighborhood called Chicagoq, owned by Lee Ann Whippen. She has competition ribs on her menu, charges an extra $8 per slab and sells out all the time. More expensive than most of the Que places, probably because of the location, but also one of the better ones. And an AWESOME bourbon selection!

Duck salumi:
Soaked in spiced run two days the one week of cure with salt, sugar, cure#1, grains of paradise, and juniper berries. Rolled, tied cold smoked two hours then hot smoked to internal temp of 150°
Cold smoked cheddar, pepper jack and swiss three hours then packaged for a week.
Cold smoked olives then herbs, olive oil and garlic.
House made bread.

Smoked Lobster and Fettuccine;
Cold smoked lobster one hour then hot smoked two hours with additions of compound butter made with our rub. House cured and smoked tasso.
House made fettuccine. Tomatoes, asparagus, fresh basil, garlic and olive oil.

Smoked Duck Ramen
Braised with ginger, onion, garlic. Chilled then cold smoked with rice, earl grey tea, brown sugar and orange peel. House made ramen noodles in a rich broth of pork and duck studded with bok choy, shiitake mushrooms and scallions.