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Losing my brisket cred

FM Former Member
OK, call it beginner's luck, but I smoked my first brisket Fourth of July weekend, 2010 on my then brand new '25.' It was awesome and got rave reviews. (As an aside, I was so concerned about how it would turn out that I purchased 5 pounds of flank steak, which I grill all of the time, 'just in case.' Well everything turned out and we had 15 pounds of awesome beef for 8 people!)

So I went to the butcher shop and purchased a 10# packer, marinaded it several hours, applied a rub and smoked it at 225 about 12 hours to 185 and did the FTC thing. Total rest time, about 2 hours. Like a said, it was awesome.

So this year on the Fourth I tried again, this time with a 5# flat from Costco. (We've always had great success with pork and beef from Costco so I thought this would be a no brainer.) Did the same marinade and rub and cooked to 185. Result->hockey puck. On a scale of 1-10 the first was a 10 and the second a 1.

So last weekend I tried again, twice. I used a different probe since I was thinking the one on the smoker was misleading me. Results: an 8 and a 7. Both had good flavor but neither was anywhere near as moist or tender as the first one I tried.

Tried again yesterday. Set smoker at 200 rather than the 225 I'd used before and stopped when the temperature got to 170--again thinking that I may have overcooked in the past. Total cook time was about 7 hours for a 5-6# flat. Another 7. Good flavor but dry. I even took Smokin Okie's advice and notched the corner before smoking to make sure I was cutting against the grain later. I should point out that my first one was fall-apart, fork cuttable and moist as could be. So my standards are pretty high and I haven't really gotten close since then. (Perhaps my 7 and 8 should really be 6 and 7).

It seems to me that the next thing to try is to go back to the butcher shop and get another packer and try to replicate my first attempt. Any other ideas about what to try?

Dave
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andyjandyjMember
quote:
Originally posted by wolverine:
Set smoker at 200 rather than the 225 I'd used before and stopped when the temperature got to 170--again thinking that I may have overcooked in the past.


Or maybe it was undercooked. I usually take mine up to 195ish. An undercooked brisket can be tough & dry giving the impression that it's been overcooked. I'd take a probe and do a "toothpick" test starting at around 190, when it slides in and out easily, it's done.
M maxqMember
Just to clarify, the 1st brisket you cooked (July 2010) was a packer?

On your packer smokes, did you record a temp when you pulled them?

It sounds like you're having success with packers and flops with flats. Your 5# flat from Costco...I'm thinking 185 wasn't enough to get it tender. Did you probe it for resistance?

Packers are a lot more forgiving than flats...you don't have the extra fat the point provides, with a flat. Once you ran into your 1st problem cooking a flat you began to change up everything, cook temps, pull temps,time, etc.

My suggestion, packers or flats, cook at 235-250 and don't pull 'em till they probe easily...no matter what the internal temp says. If you can get the flats tender but they come out dry, try injecting.

Keep notes and keep your change-ups minimal so you can more easily track ups and down.

Hope that helps
FM Former Member
This reminds me of a bygone day when I tried to grow houseplants. They kept dying so I watered them more. They still died so I watered them still more. You know the punchline

Once that second flat came out like a hockey puck, I decided I had overcooked it so all of my future changes were backing off the cook temp or the temp at which I took the brisket out. Sounds like I may have been going in the wrong direction.

I do want to try the packer again but I think first I'll try another flat from Costco and stick to your recommendations on the temp.

Thanks for the suggestions.

Dave
T tomMember
Costco,like many retail grocers,buy small well trimmed,very lean flats for our "granny" to make our favorite pot roast/New England boiled dinner with potatoes,carrots,onion.

It is very succesful/sells well.

Yes,an experienced cook,to prove they can do it,can cook a tender-if not good -small piece of brisket.

Like the good cooks above,hunt around for as large a packer as you can find,and hope for choice.
FM Former Member
OK I'm rethinking my above plan to try another Costco flat. And while I agree with the several suggestions on taking notes, that's something I didn't do the first time. As a result...

I recall purchasing the packer at the butcher and it was a pretty good sized piece of beef. I also am using a CS25 smoker which required that I split it up and cook part on one rack and part on another. I assume that the split would separate the flat and the deckle, correct? Does it matter which one goes on top? Fat up or fat down?

Thanks

Dave
N nordyMember
I cook full packers on my 020 (same size as the 025). You've got a couple of options if it's too big. 1) separate point and the flat and cook on separate racks 2) Trim the hard fat between the point and flat and roll up the point a bit so that it fits 3) fold the end of the flat under so that it fits.

Fat up or down... well, honestly it doesn't matter. Some will swear leaving the fat pad up will "marinate" the meat as the fat renders, others say that is bunk and put the fat down to protect the meat from the hot heat source below.

I've done it both ways and it really doesn't matter. I usually go fat side down in my 020 and fat side up on my PG1000. I guess that puts me in the "protect from the heat" crowd. However if I'm honest, it's just what works for me.

Try it both ways, it's an excuse to cook more!

Nordy
FM Former Member
In all the above, I see an occassional discussion, but the KEY point that needs to be understood is how to tell when it's done.

You said you pulled it at 170. Why did you pull it? Did someone suggest or were you guessing? 170 is over 25 degree undercooked.

From Brisket 101:
quote:
I cooked the smaller to 185 and the larger to 190. The time was fast to reach the temps than the 1.5 hours, but the smaller one was trimmed of some fat. That’s why you can’t you a simple time x weight. “It’s done when It’s done” as I always say. Personally for us, the 185 was too "tough" but I did it for this test.


Also, check out the video in the Brisket101 update just below this one and it covers some other points. Like make sure it's a Choice, not select or less quality.
FM Former Member
The reason I pulled it early is that the previous try--which was my first try with smaller Costco flat--was hard and dry. I presumed that I had overcooked it. (Actually I may have since I think the probe on the smoker is broken. For all of the tries after the second one I've used a separate probe.)

I was working from the assumption, which I now realize was false--that the smaller brisket might not need to be cooked to quite such a high as a temperature. I think it was really that second try which led me astray. Also I guess I was still thinking in steak mode--that hockey puck flat reminded me of an overcooked steak, so I decided not to cook it as long.

But I've seen the light thanks to all the responses. Thanks.

Dave

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